Dionysus

Gerry Quinn · 08 Dec 2010, 03:37 · from 2010-December.txt.gz

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From: gerryq at indigo.ie (Gerry Quinn)
Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2010 03:37:52 -0000
Subject: (urth) Dionysus
References: <SNT123-W924CF06ED5FC26287FEABCF2C0 at phx.gbl><4796709EEEC54B62A2718FC89143477F@jill>
	<4CFEC8DB.9090603 at gmail.com>
Message-ID: <18B884BEF2F3446EAA2A35CD31A4237B@jill>

From: "James Wynn" <crushtv at gmail.com>
>> Gerry Quinn-

>> Okay, where is Dionysius referenced?  That's the one I was thinking of. 
>> It seems to me that the strands linking Dionysius to the outsider are 
>> very thin indeed.
>
> Um....the "son of Thyone", is discussed or referenced at least four times 
> in Return to the Whorl. That's a big deal being made of the child of an 
> extremely minor goddess. The way the child is described makes me think it 
> is somehow referencing Silk...and Silk is the prophet of the Outsider.

Okay, I've looked up those passages.  Yes, Dionysius is referenced as the 
son of Thyone. In fact, Horn/Silk accepts as plausible Hound's proposition 
that Dionysius may possibly be the same as the Outsider.  The Outsider 
himself - not Silk.

    "Then what I was going to ask about is pretty silly. I was going to ask 
if it isn't possible they're really the same."

    The man lying on the floor said nothing.

    "Since we don't know the names. That the Outsider is Thyone's son, the 
wine god, too."

This may be just a reference to the normal process in which myths mutate and 
aspects of ancient gods become aspects of newer ones, though.  It's 
reasonable to believe that some elements of Dionysius appear in Christ, whom 
I identify with the Outsider. Certainly a couple of symbols - wine, 
resurrection - appear, though I don't believe their significance is the 
same.

But it's a far cry from this academic analysis of gods to ascribe major 
significance to ut and to draw conclusions based on possible symbols of 
Dionysius.  Because every god has a million symbols.

> Additionally, I have argued that the very word "inhuma" was chosen for its 
> association with Dionysus, the god of the vine. There are undeniable, 
> although unexplained, associations between the inhumi and vines. And 
> Quetzal mimics Dionysus's deeds.

If the inhumi are associated with vines, those are the lianas on Green, 
which as far as I know do not yield grapes.  'Vine' is a name for any 
traiuling or climbing plant - not every vine is a grape vine.  To my mind 
this is no connection.

> See the problem is something I see in my professional work all the time. 
> Some people think things are  unimportant or easily done...that is, they 
> are contemptuous toward them...when/because they know very little about 
> them. They lack the ability to be impressed by anything not easily within 
> their own grasp.

Does your professional work involve literary criticism?  Because if it does 
not, the strength of that argument is less than you suppose, and its import 
may be considerably different from what you intend.  Ideas *are* easy. 
Rigorously worked out ideas that can stand up to criticism are not. I am 
impressed only by arguments that can stand the heat of critical analysis.

- Gerry Quinn

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