Merger

Son Of Witz · 28 Jan 2011, 22:20 · from 2011-January.txt.gz

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From: sonofwitz at butcherbaker.org (Son Of Witz)
Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2011 14:20:15 -0800
Subject: (urth) Merger
In-Reply-To: <SNT123-W6864A21256A1F4C7370B5CFE10 at phx.gbl>
References: <SNT123-W6864A21256A1F4C7370B5CFE10 at phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <ABD9714C-B8B1-424C-BAAF-04E2A1A403AB at butcherbaker.org>

On Jan 28, 2011, at 10:50 AM, Lee Berman wrote:
> This is paralleled with Severian in UotNS I think. He is no longer plagued by spontaneous
> takeovers by Thecla but I guess she is still there, just unneeded. The old Autarch pops up
> once, but only at the appropriate time and need.
> 
> I think the idea of a merger is pretty appropriate, a la Daimler-Chrysler. The larger company
> took over the smaller one. There is a new merged identity though if there is confict the majority 
> partner tends to have the merged corporation serve its needs above the minority partner.

I'm on the same page with Lee here.
I hadn't really considered Thecla's near-absence from UotNS.  IIRC, she is barely there.
Your corporate comparison echos the idea that the Alzabo is a Proctor & Gamble metaphor.

> From: Jordon Flato
> Isn't there a difference in what happens to the 'memories' or 'identities' in Severian as opposed to everyone else, including the Alzabo?  Sev has the power to restore life.  I've always been fairly certain that for Severian, the people he brings into himself are more alive, in a real way, than for any previous Autarch, or certainly and Vodellarii or ingesters of the alembic.  Perhaps this plays a role in why Severian succeeds when Appian fails.  Severian doesn't just have the memories of past lives in him, I think they are really alive in him in a fundamental way, which is new, unique, and unseen in any other instance of ingestion of the Alembic.

I agree with Flato in that Thecla is alive in him in a different way than the Analeptic absorbtion.
Lee's point about her not making a fuss in UotNS is making me wonder if there is a true merger between the two.
The dream, where they read from the same book with their hair braided together is the best. By the end, Severian's narrative infuses her voice with less WTF? disruption, no?

> From: Gerry Quinn:
> Certainly it's different in this regard, but to say this is why Severian succeeded while previous Autarch's failed involves a bit of a time-loop semi-paradox.  The problem is that Severian's power is also the *result* of him succeeding - he has access to the negentropic power of the White Fountain and can turn back time to heal the sick, resurrect the dead etc.
>  
> Had a previous Autarch succeeded, he also (or instead) would have had those powers.

I think there was no success to be had for a previous Autarch.
IIRC, the ones who tried are Ymar, Appian, & Severian.
Appian was a setup, and Ymar was the first, inspired by Sev, who planted the "tradition" that he hoped to partake in to Ymar, who then started the Tradition.

Can someone hook me up with th e story where Appian is named?  

On Jan 28, 2011, at 1:54 PM, Dan'l Danehy-Oakes wrote:

> Has nobody but me considered the possibility that Severian's presence
> has rekindled Becan's mind in the alzabo (much the way he rekindles
> Thecla in himself) so that Becan actually overrides the alzabo's
> instincts to protect his family?

Ha! I love it.

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