Rape and Misogyny in Wolfe

Chris · 21 Apr 2003, 18:39 · from urth-v0304.mbox · original

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From: "Chris" <rasputin_ at hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: (urth) Rape and Misogyny in Wolfe
Date: Mon, 21 Apr 2003 18:39:24 +0000
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Having time only for a "short" reply...

To Nutria: No offense taken, at least by me. I just couldn't be sure, and=20
wanted to clarify what was being talked about.

re: the question at hand
There is one, I believe, in the Latro books. The way those are written make=
s=20
the incident hazy in my memory and I unfortunately can't dredge up the=20
details (might as well ask Latro, for all the good I am there).

Best example, I believe, is Horn and Seawrack in OBW.

Severian, of course, you've mentioned.

Silk doesn't seem to get dragged into this (at least not in the Long Sun=20
series), but Auk does.

Usually there are extenuating circumstances, as alga pointed out. These=20
extenuating circumstances aren't enough to excuse any of them, however (as=20
Horn himself points out to Seawrack, and Auk may have said something simila=
r=20
come to think of it).

re: misogyny, I tend to think the word has been extended to refer to a lot=20
of things beyond its real scope - such that it gets to be very difficult to=20
have a sensible discussion about it. I would vigorously deny that Wolfe is =
a=20
misogynist if the accusation were made. A claim might be made that his=20
metaphors and female characters reflect a general attitude that is=20
objectionable - to actually debate that would require such care that I'm no=
t=20
sure I'm quite smart enough to take part in that. But even if you grant tha=
t=20
much, this is still not misogyny IMHO.

>I feeling pretty dense right now since I can think of only one rape in my
>reading of Wolfe right now: the infamous act by Severian on the
>semi-conscious Jolenta. I'm tracing my memory for any others and I just
>can't come up with any others -- I recently re-read tFHoC and I don't=20
>recall
>a rape of a female slave.
>
>I for one would appreciate a listing of the rapes -- particularly any "Rape
>as Salvation" events (the Jolenta one does not apply IMO).
>
>Also, it has been frequently reference that Wolfe exhibits misogyny. I've
>yet to encounter it (and notice it -- which may be revealing about me). I'm
>curious what other readers have read in Wolfe that they consider to be
>misogynistic. Possibly it is in works I've yet to read.
>
>As a premtive shot, I don't consider the Trivigaunti to an example of
>misogyny. Trivigaunte does not seem to be anymore distopian than Viron=20
>which
>is quite machismotic -- and we are constantly reminded that men aren't
>treated any worse there than women are in Viron.
>
>--- Crush
>
>
>
>--

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