the problem with gaiman, mieville, and pullman

Dan'l Danehy-Oakes · 29 Nov 2004, 15:08 · from 2004-November.txt.gz

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From: danldo at gmail.com (Dan'l Danehy-Oakes)
Date: Mon Nov 29 15:08:47 2004
Subject: (urth) the problem with gaiman, mieville, and pullman
In-Reply-To: <20041129211117.42986.qmail at web50303.mail.yahoo.com>
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	<20041129211117.42986.qmail at web50303.mail.yahoo.com>
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On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 13:11:17 -0800 (PST), Nathan Spears
<spearofsolomon at yahoo.com> wrote:

> I just wanted to interject a quick comment.  Having read several
> interviews with Mieville, I think that he is very interested in how
> his worlds function, and specifically, how the politics work.  

That much is clearly true. In fact, there are times when he comes
parlously close to Poughkeepsie, to borrow Le Guin's trope.

> I might be getting myself in trouble, because I can't remember
> how much intelligent discussion of M's work I've actually read
> on this list, but here's what I remember:
> 
> He doesn't like the fantasy tradition of having an aristocratic
> society living on air; for instance, in Tolkien, he would be wary
> of the inhabitants of Minas Tirath. What do they do?  How do
> they get food, support an economy, etc?  

That's a common and rather false criticism of Tolkien and _tLotR_. 
It isn't emphasized, but Tolkien does in fact mention the farming 
communities of Gondor in several places. Minas Tirith supports 
itself much the way, say, Imperial Rome or medieval Paris did - 
by being a center of trade and governance, and a military capital.

> I think I remember reading about how he laid out a whole 
> economic and political (ecopolitical?)

Politico-economic, usually...

> foundation for his world before he started setting the story.  In
> fact, I read some comments which made a pretty strong case for
> the idea that M's world, and the creatures that inhabit it, are
> more interesting/important that the stories he tells there.  
> I have a feeling someone said that on this list.

It probably wasn't me, but I agree with whoever said it. The
stories are actually fairly kludgey. Reading _PSS_ I remember
thinking "There isn't a single character in this book I like, let
alone identify with." While this is not true of _The Scar_, it's 
badly imbalanced in terms of pacing - the first half of the book 
drags on, the second half rips along; it took me less time to read
the entire last half than any fifty pages of the first half. The first
hundred pages or so could easily (and imio should have) been
cut by a sympathetic editor to about twenty, as much of it is just
moody stage setting; in fact, the first part could have been done
away with easily, and the few bits that remained significant for
the rest of the book worked in as flashbacks. Mieville is a
relentlessly _linear_ storyteller; I don't recall a significant 
flashback in either of the two books I've read.

> [...] the person you were responding to is (might be) pretty
> close to the mark with his summary of Mieville, especially from
> Mieville's own viewpoint.

He might well. I'm not saying that there is no serious political
content; I'm saying that I'm not finding it. The internal politics
of Bas-Lag seem sufficiently alien that I don't find much, as 
Tolkien called it, _applicability_ - let alone allegory! - to the
"real" world. 

--Dan'l

-- 
www.livejournal.com/users/sturgeonslawyer
"Saddam would still be in power if he were the President
of the United States, and the world would be a lot better off."
     -- The Forty-Third President, 10/8/04

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