Increate on trial

Roy C. Lackey · 31 Mar 2005, 00:11 · from 2005-March.txt.gz

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From: rclackey at stic.net (Roy C. Lackey)
Date: Thu Mar 31 00:11:26 2005
Subject: (urth) Re:  Increate on trial
Message-ID: <001701c535c9$3721fc80$a13ec6d8 at rclackey.stic.net>

Adam wrote:
>But no bigger a problem than those in the real world who died before
Jesus's
>birth. For that matter, the inhabitants of Urth are virtually all damned
>anyway. There was a discussion about whether Christianity existed in Sev's
>day a long time ago on the list, but I don't recall what conclusion was
>reached, if any; but if there are any Christians still around, they're
>surely a very small minority.

Agreed.

>I've never really understood how Christian readers of Wolfe can take the
>Christian imagery surrounding the New Sun at face value, ignoring the fact
>that unlike Jesus, it brings not salvation but indiscriminate death and
>damnation.
>
>(Incidentally, I don't like the idea that the Sun cycle takes place in a
>previous universe either -- I'd like to believe that it was something Wolfe
>dreamed up after the fact, so I could reject it with a clear conscience --
>but since Wolfe did say it, I feel I have to take it into account.)

Maybe Wolfe placed the Sun cycle in a previous universe in an attempt to
dodge the problem presented by the Incarnation that I mentioned. But both
Newton and Einstein would frown on uncaused effects -- those Christian
symbols.

>> At one point Sev noted the "spangled sky of Yesod", and asked Apheta
about
>> other worlds. She said "When we require them, the Hierogrammates will
build
>> more -- worlds as fair as this, or more fair. Suns for them too, should
we
>> require more suns." (p-142) It's hard for me to imagine the Creator
>> permitting such godlike feats without express leave to do so. From
_Genesis_
>> onward, the Increate seems to take grave exception to such things.
>
>I'm not sure what to say about this argument; it doesn't seem convincing at
>all to me. Though Wolfe is a conservative Catholic, I doubt he believes
that
>the Babel story is literally true. And as Andy Robertson pointed out,
>there's no direct evidence in BotNS or UotNS of the Increate directly
>intervening in the created world in any way, if I'm not mistaken.

Perhaps not in those five books; I'd have to think about it. Water into
wine? The Cathedral of the Pelerines rising into the night sky? Sev called
it a "miracle" when he and Dorcas saw it rise. (SHADOW, 243) And the lady
vendor in Saltus said of her scientific-minded grandson-in-law's
explanation, "He can't see the Hand in nature." (CLAW, ch. III)

But in the larger universe of the Sun cycle we have Silk's epiphany, and how
do we account for his coming back to life after he was buried in the rubble,
but by the intervention of the Outsider?

-Roy

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