Hierodule = alien, not Hierogrammate

Dan Parmenter21 Mar 2001, 13:29original as archived

↰ answers Robert Borski · by quotation

Bob Borski Bawled:

11 quoted lines

I'm surprised this argument wasn't resurrected by its proponents earlier, citing the "Merryn had problems with animals too" line, which seems to support the notion--especially if you buy into my theory that Merryn is the biological daughter of the Cumaean.

Unfortunately, the Cumaean-as-inhumu argument seems severely undercut by the following passage from URTH (p. 357), where Severian is talking to the alien Ossipago: *********** "...the Cumaean, she was a Hierodule, like you. Father Inire told me." Famulimus and Barbatus nodded. *********** Unless, of course, you're now arguing that the inhumi are creatures of Yesod...

Hold on. I don't think that hierodule necessarily = hierogrammate. My impression was that "Hierodule" covered all aliens. Dr. Talos suggests "extrasolarians" which might not include Martians but definitely covers Inhumi. Shellac *This is WHORL, for discussion of Gene Wolfe's Book of the Long Sun.

Robert Borski22 Mar 2001, 00:58original as archived

↳ follows Dan Parmenter · by subject

Shellac having expostulated: <Hold on. I don't think that hierodule necessarily = hierogrammate. My impression was that "Hierodule" covered all aliens. Dr. Talos suggests "extrasolarians" which might not include Martians but definitely covers Inhumi.> I doubt you'll find much support for the notion that Hierodule is a generic term for all aliens--unlike, say, cacogen, or as you mention, extrasolarian. From LEXICON URTHUS: "Hierodule one belonging to a race created by the Hierogrammates of the higher universe, Yesod." (p. 168) From URTH OF THE NEW SUN, with Barbatus talking to Severian: ********* "You call us Hierodules, and that is your word and not ours, just as Barbatus, Famulimus and Ossipago are your words, words we have chosen because they are not common and describe us better than your other words would. Do you know what Hierodule means, this word of your own tongue?" "I know that you are creatures of this universe [i.e., Yesod], shaped by those of the next to serve them here. And that the service they desire of you is the shaping of our race, of humanity, because we are the cognates of those who shaped them in the ages of the previous creation." Famulimus trilled, "Hierodule is 'holy slave.'" (p. 36) ********* So clearly Wolfe is using "Hierodule" specifically to designate the aliens who hail from Yesod, not Briah or the front pages of the National Enquirer. Robert Borski *This is WHORL, for discussion of Gene Wolfe's Book of the Long Sun.

Hierodule = alien, not HierogrammateWhorl